Overcoming Obstacles and Loving Your Body - with Gym Owner, Author, and Personal Trainer Vanessa Bogenholm

Vanessa Bogenholm: So I go there and pick up a pair of shoes, tan and brown Nike's. I can tell you what they are. And the next morning I make this big plan. So I decide if I'm such a hard worker that I can save enough money to buy a house. Why can't I run and not just 23 steps, but 24? So I turn around and go run. And I'm thrilled because that means I ran farther than I planned and I sit down rest for a minute and then run back home. Kevin Chang: Hello and welcome to the RaceMob podcast. This is episode number 64. I'm Kevin entrepreneur technology and fitness nerd. And I'm joined by the head coach of RaceMob and master motivator, the incomparable Bertrand Newson. What can we say about Vanessa, this entrepreneurial bad-ass and bay area legend is here to tell it how it is. Her incredible introduction into running is quite literally the stuff that movies are made out of an overweight, an overworked 13 year old Vanessa decided to change her life and ended up losing over 60 pounds. And then just two years later, competing in and then winning a marathon. This was before most races even had female entrance. The story highlights, the hard work and dedication that Vanessa just exudes, even though an Achilles injury derailed her running career, it didn't stop her from helping people as one of the most sought after personal trainers on the planet. Vanessa has a long client list. And so many success stories that she's actually in the middle of publishing a book. After taking years away from the sport, she's back to dominating these long distance runs. And she has so many tips for athletes nuggets, for those people looking to lose weight and tidbits for those looking for some extra motivation. Heck this driven entrepreneur even purchased a boxing gym during the middle of the pandemic. But she's the most proud of the charitable organization that she's founded that helps every single foster kid in Santa Clara. All the show notes can be found online at RaceMob dot com slash podcast and without further ado here's our conversation. Bertrand: Hello, RaceMob family. We are in for real treat today. Coach Vanessa fitness, trailblazer, avid runner professional personal trainer business owner, gym, private studio, Las Vegas, California has a extensive, extensive running shoe collection. And as an adolescent, as a teenager finished her very first marathon and in that summer lost over 60 pounds and that's just the tip of the iceberg. Welcome coach Vanessa! Vanessa Bogenholm: Thanks guys. It's really great to be here. Kevin Chang: Yeah. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome. I mean the, the story is incredible. We want to dive right into it. Talk to us about growing up. I mean, I know that you have an incredible. Vanessa Bogenholm: So I grew up in Santa Maria, small town. My parents were awful. They couldn't keep a job. So I lived in a single wide mobile home and was a very fat child and picked on for it. Kevin Chang: Hmm. Vanessa Bogenholm: So I grew up in a town. It was basketball town. Everybody wanted to play basketball. My mother hoped I would fit in. So I went to this camp to play basketball. And this really nice coach said to me when I couldn't jump. When I was the slowest runner, when I shot granny goose style, literally, Vanessa, you probably want to get fit before school starts. Now, this is 1980 and my hero, even though it was a fat child, was Frank Shorter. So I go to the library. I get every book on running I can, I'm already working full time. I'm an assistant manager of a boot store. Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: And the owner also owned a Footlocker and all the community college writers work there. So I go there and pick up a pair of shoes, tan and brown Nike's. I can tell you what they are. And the next morning I make this big plan. I'm going to go out and run. I read these books all night. I look at what strike training is. I go out my front door and I run 23 steps and I die. I'm 200 pounds. I'm asthmatic. I have severe allergies, never exercise a day in my life. And I sit on the corner and I cry because I realized what a loser I really am. And I quit everything. And I just, I'm just gonna go home. So I start to walk home. This is right before I turned 14. I just bought my parents a real house. We've moved out of the mobile home two weeks before and I walking up to a home that I've just purchased for my parents. Kevin Chang: Wow. 13? Vanessa Bogenholm: Yeah. So it's. Craziest ridiculous stuff. So I decide if I'm such a hard worker that I can save enough money to buy a house. Why can't I run and not just 23 steps, but 24. So I turn around and go run. And I'm thrilled because that means I ran farther than I planned and I sit down rest for a minute and then run back home. My mother's leaving for work. And I said, what are you doing outside five 30 in the morning when she's leaving for work. And I told her, leave me alone. This was my own personal thing. Within, I'd say a month I am running six to seven miles continuously within two months, I'm running this 11 mile. Around Santa Maria every day. And I ran my first race, which was that 10 mile road race. So that's my running history. And I went to high school. I'm now 135, 140 pounds and grew four inches tall. And I'm an athlete. Now the funniest part about this Santa Maria was 22,000 Peele. So anytime that he was running around town, people would know, right? So the cross country coach walks up to me and says, Hey, you must be coming out for my team. And I said, I don't know what cross country is. I'm marathon training. Now. Bertrand Newson: Hmm. Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: I can't even imagine what this coach thought. And he said, Well, we run these three mile runs through the park and I go, what a waste of time. I mean, it just didn't strike me as something that would be great. And then I tell him I work full time, so I can't do that. And he says, I see you around all the time. You don't have to come to practice to show up on Wednesdays when we have meets. And that's what I did. So I showed up on Wednesdays. I mean, you know what a cross-country race looks, people are running. It's crazy. I didn't know what this was. And I was like, they're all bumping into each other. I'll just run in front of them. It just makes sense to me. Kevin Chang: Okay. Vanessa Bogenholm: Just, it was the dumbest idea ever, but, you know obviously it worked out. Bertrand Newson: many years did you run cross country coach? Vanessa Bogenholm: So I ran cross country. I have lots of cross country kids that run at schools, local schools. I had such disrespect for it because it was nowhere at the level I was. I was running 80 to 100 miles a week as a 14 and 15 year old. And so I would run and I'd go to work. So I had to finish by five o'clock because I had to get to work by five 30. You know, it was just the way my life was. And so I run, I ran and let me think. My junior year I won my state division. We were like division three. And so I won that and it was, you know, and it was like that the coaches now talk to you. And I remember the Cal state Fullerton coach said, didn't you just want a marathon? And he was looking at me like, who's this kid. And because back then we did not know how to turn. I completely popped my Achilles tendon off my calf in my senior year and a cross country race. And it was surgically. So that ended my running career as a kid. And I did not run again for 30 something years. So if you ever pop your Kili off your calf, it literally rolls down in your leg and they pull it back up and stitch it back to your calf. And most people don't recover very well. If at all, I think it took me a minimum seven or eight year to walk without a load. And so never really thought I would run like I do now. So pretty lucky. Bertrand N: And you do run this. This is well chronicled. And not just casually, still competitively placing routinely in your age group. So what is it about running that really speaks to you? Coach Minnesota? That's kind of a broad open-ended question. But clearly it resonates with you on some things. Vanessa Bogenholm: And I'm going to go back to this weekend. So I ran a 5k on the track and you want to talk about being in a fishbowl with a couple of thousand people screaming at you. It was the weirdest experience, and I haven't had a track meet since I was in high school. And, you know, I can click my first mile and 6 59, I mean, wow. Right. And some guy that I didn't know, but he knew me from Strava was screaming at me after he finished his race. Cause the guys laughed the women and he was like, she's 16 seconds ahead of you. And he's like screaming at me and I'm like, who was this guy? Right. You know? And then I win the race and I'm ready to puke and I'm laughing. Bertrand Newson: Hmm. Vanessa Bogenholm: And he walks up and he goes, I'm so-and-so I follow you on Strava. And I'm laughing my head off when I says, this is what running is. It's pushing yourself past your capability and then somebody helping you. I mean, that was a beautiful moment. So there you go. Kevin Chang: Before we got on air. You, you talked a little bit. Marathon training, even as a teenager being one of the, you know, and those were very, very early days, obviously we're talking about you know, they're not a lot of female runners during that time, especially not a lot of female runners doing the marathon. So, I mean, talk to us a little bit about, like, I get a little bit of the picture, like the grit the grit needed to yeah. To do this marathon training and stuff, but yeah. Vanessa Bogenholm: Little other part of story. So I'm a stupid kid before the internet and I get these books and Frank, shorter's my hero. So I write them a letter and another letter and another letter I am running. I'm following what you do or, I mean, I'm certainly run a hundred miles a week cause we don't know any better. And he writes me back and says, great job and sends me an autographed photo, right? From his 1972 Olympics. So it's fantastic. It's actually still in my studio here in San Jose. Got it. Since I was a kid. And years and years go by and I'm at an event and I walk up to him and I said, hi, Mr. Shorter, I'm Vanessa. He goes freaking heck. Bertrand Newson: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: And it's such a moment. And he hugs me and I'm like, how do you know who I am? And he goes, you look the same. You sent me a picture of yourself. And I go at a race in a turquoise singlet. And it was like such a funny moment. But I think. We just didn't have any clue how to train when Frank and these guys talk, they just ran a lot. I mean, if you read the bill Rogers book, he just ran out on the lake and read as fast as he could. And they didn't ever slow down and no taper, you know, that's what we did. And women's bodies are different, but no one knew that, but the hips thing, or growing and no, we didn't know that. That's why we got, that's why they got hurt. Kevin Chang: Okay. It talks to us about the marathon. So why a marathon distance or was it just to go? Yeah. Vanessa Bogenholm: so, so back then, there was no five Ks, 10, 10 Ks and a half now. So let's think about this as a runner, you did one of three things, the 100, the mile or the marathon, not a sprinter. I couldn't imagine doing the mile. And so that's what was left for someone who was a grinder. Right. So you ran a marathon. And there was an occasional 10 miles or something, but there's not like there is now. That's not them like that. Yeah. That's why. Kevin Chang: I mean, talk to us about the first marathon or first couple of marathon. Yeah. Vanessa Bogenholm: The first marathon I go down to the LA area and, you know, it's the first one. I have no clue what I'm doing. I don't have any friends there. I pick up my number and I'm looking at the sides and it says, you know, 7 45, 8 o'clock. And I'm like, we're all starting:at eight. I'm like, like lost. And this guy says, how fast are you going to run a mile? And I go eight, 15. And he goes, you stand here. Now, all these guys were running up and down the side, jumping up and down. I didn't know why people would put all that energy out before running 26.2 miles? Kevin Chang: Yeah. Vanessa Bogenholm: I'm baffled. And there's no women, right. Kevin Chang: Wow. Bertrand Newson: Oh, wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: So we take off the gun goes off and I'm running. Now we have no GPS watches. There's, there's nothing guys. And I completely hallucinate at mile 20 back then somebody would tell you if you are a front runner, what number you are. I go to this water station and this guy says six. And I said, Where are the six ma how can we make the six mile? There's no way we're at the six mile and I'm losing it. And this older man says, no, honey, you're the sixth one. Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogen: I'm not doing it. I'm not doing it. I'm finished. I'm over. He goes, no, I'll run with you and I'll help you finish. So I run and I finish and pass out, end up in the paramedics area with an IV. And so chafed, you will never, ever. And my mother is losing it. She's never seen someone pass out from exercise. You know, I've never came from an athletic Fallon who knows what the heck's happening. And the guy comes to the organizer of the race and he says, is she okay? Cause she's, you know, the 18 and under winder, can she come to the stage you know, that kind of thing. And I'm like, wow. And had no clue what I was doing. Kevin Chang: Your very first marathon. Yeah. And you're 18 and under winner. That is well, Vanessa Bogenholm: Yeah, but I came back to school on Monday with the t-shirt on thinking I was the coolest thing to ever, right. Because nobody I knew had ever done a marathon. Nobody at school did no one's parents did. I know this is 1980. And then I knew three months later was a marathon near my house, right? Within 11 miles, which means I could practice on the course. No, the course sleep well. Do all those things that the books talked about and I had experienced now, so I knew how to do it, and it was much better. And that's the one that I won, which I still have the t-shirt from hangs in my studio, in the bathroom. And it's pretty worn out. Cause I wore it for 150 times. Cause it was like the coolest thing ever. Yeah. So. Bertrand Newson: Inquiring minds want to know Coach V what was that first marathon time? Vanessa Bogenho: I have no idea. Isn't that the funniest thing, you know, somebody else that the other day, cause I knew I was around three and a half nowhere. I did it. I mean, so you have to. So you guys, this is not 22. We're going to get the marathon, the 1984 Olympics. And do that. I had to get to three hours, right? That was the Olympic standard back then to get into the Olympic marathon trials. Now it's 2: 45 for women, but 2:30, whatever it was. And, no, it's 2: 03. And I didn't couldn't get there. So I knew I couldn't get there. So my thought was 88 that I could get there by 88. Right. There was no way I could get the by, by 83 to get it there. So, yeah. But then I had to turn my... Bertrand Newson: That was your level of drive and focus and vision. You talk about goal planning. Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: But there wasn't that many women. So it wasn't like I don't get didn't seem so impossible, right? Not like today when you go today and there's women in my age group running six and a half minutes on a, on a marathon. So. Kevin Chang: It's still it's. Yeah, incredible. I mean, it's incredible, especially self-driven without. Much coaching, you know, coaching via written mail and books that you could pick up and, you know, training herself and, and then getting there. Can you imagine only it's just a couple of years earlier being 200 pounds and, you know, and, and, and that drive that grit, that determination, that ability to, you know, continue to push yourself. Yeah. Vanessa Bogenholm: So, I mean, I've worked with a lot of overweight people. I don't look at it as this drive and grit. If you can find why someone's eating, eating is done to fix something psychologically. If I can find that psychological problem and they will admit to it, then we can tackle it. But if they say, I don't know how I ended up this, I never eat that much. All that stuff that you hear, there's unhappiness somewhere and pain. I can find that place. I can get the weight off of somebody because that's what I got off my son. When I started to run, I no longer was bullied because now I was strong and cool. And it went away right now, became mentally tough. Right. You cannot run 10 miles a day and not get mentally tough. And that's what I lacked as a team. Bertrand Ne: And, Coach V let's. More so with a weight loss because a good portion of America's population is dealing with obesity in some level, especially with our youth. And I mean, Kevin... Vanessa Bo: How did this happen? How did this Bertrand Newson: Kevin I've talked about, we've had a couple of weight loss challenges or cut the crap 14 day challenges with a good nutritionist friend of ours coach Tony Julian, giving her a shout out. From your perspective, you know, we've talked about the psychological, but ultimately there needs to be some changes in the diet, coupled with ag with that activity. And what are you seeing? What's the common denominator that you've seen with people when it does it, does it clicks for them and... Vanessa Bogenholm: So I have to eat for what I want to do. My goal today is to make fuel for tomorrow. If I drink six scotches and two cheeseburgers. I can not run eight miles in the morning bottom line. So when I start with a client and they are heavy drinkers, which I've had a lot of CEOs, a lot of heavy drinkers, I worked the hell out of them the next morning. And then they think I'm going to see Vanessa on Tuesday. I'm not going to drink on Monday. That's the backwards principle. This works really well. Right? So if I'm a person who's overweight and I'm super unhappy, and I decided to eat three quarts of ice cream had this happen and the seed of Vanessa tomorrow, she's not going to have any mercy and she's going to pretend it didn't happen. And I can pretend you're ready for your workout and we're going to work and you're going to cry and hurt. And hopefully you kind of learn a little psychologically, that didn't work. Right. And at the end of it, we can talk about what the pain caused you to eat. And then we go from there. So I take it the way that I lost weight. I give you a goal, a place you want to be a place you admit you want to be, how do we get there as food, as a building block? Right. So that's a different thing. Bertrand Newson: Have you seen a change in what is being consumed, you know, carbs, protein, fat, all that, just from that perspective. And what's working as you've seen the evolution of diet and consumption and activity, male, female. Vanessa Bogenholm: As most people that aren't like us eat huge amounts of processed food. My whole goal is someone to not eat processed food period, to understand what processed. It's very difficult for most people. Most people don't know how to cook. They don't like vegetables. They think it's too much work. So we start with, what is your diet? Honestly, very hard for people to start. Yeah. And take the processed food out. If it comes in a box, you're not eating it. Tough, right. Then what do I eat, Vanessa? I don't know a piece of steak and broccoli. Wow. These are hard decisions. And you mean I can't eat cereal like the granola and the box? No. Could you make granola? Sure. Go for it. And learning how to cook and learning that birthdays. Christmases Thanksgivings are not about food, but about celebrating with people. Everything in our society is based about food. Change the mindset to make it about being, spending time with people and not about the food. It changes everybody. Right? So I have not had a client. I could not get the one off except for one woman. And that one woman was the only person that ever gained weight working out with me. And I said to her, after a month, this was a working, right. I want to put you with somebody else that might help and. Just didn't care. So, you know, that was the only one. Kevin Chang: Well, I was going to say it was, you know, we're a little bit tongue in cheek in, in saying that yeah, people might not know how to cook or. No, how to eat non-processed food. You know, probably because we learn about vegetables and cooking vegetables. And we've each had our own kind of journeys too. You know, I think I was overweight awhile ago and, and it's taken us a while, but it's, it's probably true if we can just change a little bit of people's mindsets a little bit of what they're eating. I love what you said about the gathering, I guess. Yeah. I always think about gathering around food around Boulder, where you're going to eat around all that. But it's true. It is about the people. If you can enjoy the people that you're with, if you can enjoy their company switching that mindset. I guess that is a totally new way to approach things, to look at things and a totally different way. And just putting yourself in somebody else's shoes in terms of what are they going through today? You know, are they having difficulty finding things to eat? Are they finding, are they having difficulty? Where was I all these years ago? So I just love this approach. Yeah. So, I mean, I guess, you know, you've had a lot of success with a lot of people who have lost over a hundred pounds. I'm assuming you get a lot of pushback kind of immediately early on right away. Or do you not? Do you, do you get people that are bought into this program are ready to go? Do you have ways to get them over some of these hurdles of, Hey, I only eat things out of a box that's simple to, Hey, this is what you should look for. Or these are simple recipes or this is, you know, the, the simplest way for you to be satiated. I guess what's kind of step one for you. And those people. Vanessa Bogenholm: Okay. So. My place here for almost 10 years, nine years, 10 years, whatever it's in San Jose. I'm very lucky. My schedule is completely full people call every week. There's no room. I charged a lot of money by the hour. I see everyone one-on-one and. No, I don't get pushed back. I don't, if you come in, say you're Kevin say you're a hundred pounds overweight, right. Called me up. We talked, we met for a couple of minutes. You come into your first workout. I'm working out with you. I don't even discuss food with you at all. We talk, we get you moving. I tell you how I'm going to monitor you. I have a, I use to coach what we're going to do. Tomorrow morning, you're going to drink 30 ounces of water when you first wake up and again, 30 ounces of water at three o'clock in the afternoon. And as you walk out, you say, but Vanessa, what do I eat? And I said, you eat what you would feel comfortable eating in front of me. And I leave it at that. I don't pressure them. I don't say anything. And I leave it for three weeks because it takes three weeks to get the water down every day. And then we come back to the food, the food thing again. Now what's your thing. I like pancakes on, on Sunday. We're probably going to take that out. Okay. How about if I have a fruit salad instead, and we start making substitutions, I'm a big believer in only eating an eight hour window of the day and doing that for decades in my own life. So how do we get there? I arrange people's times. I'm a morning person. I go to sleep by nine 30 or 10 all the time. Wake up at four 30. I figured out what your time schedule is. So we fit it to fit your body, not mine and where your timeframes are. Some people work out really well in the morning. So do work out in the afternoon. Somebody's going to be evenings. Where do you work out? What time we've picked your food around that? So I'm doing it around activities, not around the. Kevin Chang: And that's incredible. And you know, one thing that, that you mentioned that is, I guess we, we kind of gloss over it sometimes, but it is at the forefront. It's, it's very apparent. You're asking for a commitment upfront because of, you know, the, the commitment on one-on-one coaching. So they've got to show up, they've got to show up for the coach. You're asking for a, a dollar amount it's not cheap, right? So people are committing with their wallets. And when you commit to something, you know, then you are much more likely to see it through. So and I like that you're starting with activity first because activity sometimes is the. Right of like weight loss. It's like, oh, we got to go in and do workout. We get to go see progress. The dieting part. Sometimes it can be the chore if you will, for, especially for somebody, you know, who loves to eat and that sort of thing. So I liked that you kind of play on the phone part, you play on the performance aspect of it, play on the activity level aspect of it. And then, you know, people have to have that heart to heart with them. If I want to see better results, if I want to do better I'm going to, I may have to change the diet. So I love that approach. Vanessa Bogenholm: And everybody that I work with, I have to find their why. And so I have a new guy. I had to find his why, a little different he's twenty-five years old, taken about 40 pounds off of them is why is to go on to online dating. And so we're trying to make a muscular guy, right. With drop the weights. He'd never bit, he's a computer science guy work at a Google. Right. And like today he goes, see my shoulders, Vanessa. It was the cutest thing ever. So I took a video of him tossing a tire, right. Kevin Chang: good. Vanessa Bogenholm: Put this on your profile. Cool. So this is what you do, you find someone's why, and then you moved from there and then you're not making food, the focus. Bertrand Newson: How have you seen supplementation change over the years? And is that something that plays a role into how you coach nutrition and diet? Vanessa Bogenholm: So. Depending on what you're doing in life. Most of us are vitamin D deficient or not in the sun. Right. I make everyone take a blood test a couple of times a year. We'd go off that and we see where your deficiencies are. Natures. I think been going on that I should know about. Almost everyone takes magnesium and vitamin D. Those are the two big things I make everyone do. If you don't eat meat, you're going to need a B supplement. And a lot of it, if you're going to run a lot, so try to get that stuff in their diets, do that with supplements. But I don't want them doing protein shakes. I'm amazed when people do those because that's a processed food, right. So if we're trying to avoid processed food, learn how to eat real foods, can't be doing protein shakes or bars or those things. So it's a change of a mindset. Bertrand Newson: Good feedback. Kevin Chang: How do you think about programming, the cardio and the portion of it. I mean, is it really dependent on the type of person? What is your approach or philosophy for types of workouts for people. Vanessa Bogenholm: Well, when people come to me and people haven't said, Vanessa, I hate running. And I said, I don't care. You don't have to run. There's lots of things we can do. Right, right. So then what I do, so I don't kill people. And so that's, they always laugh, but that's true. So I literally figured out what they like, if you'd like to hike, you like to bike, I got a stair master, if you really want to be sadistic. So whatever you want to do, we figure out what you like and do not force people to run. Everybody has to lift weights for 20 minutes in the hour. They're with me, weightlifting and jumping up and down, make strong bones. Everyone needs that whether they be 15 years old or 75 and they do it and it makes them not get injured. Worst thing for runners is to get injured because they push themselves in the same motion over and over again too fast to break and we're all professional. So I don't go bench 200 pounds every day. I might bench for two or three minutes, 80 pounds. Right. So I do a very different kind of thing. Right. Cause I go to a complete failure on the weights. Right. That gets definition makes you ridiculously strong. Same thing with running. You run slow, you run consistent, you run with good form and guess what? Then you can run fast people. Don't like to hear that. Not as much fun to go slow and consistent and do that long stuff. It's much more fun to see how fast I can run with Joe. You know, that stuff. It does not get you in the long run where you want it. Kevin Chang: And I love what you said there at the end. With good form because I mean, we harp on slow and you know, that good form portion of it and working on that form and, and taking a look at the form. And if you can work and drill that in, then you will run faster in the long run. Vanessa Bogenholm: Well, so one of the things that I have that Galen Rupp had before he had surgery and Jake Riley and Gwen, Jordan is Haglund's Deformity, which is a bump on the back of your heel heel. I am known on YouTube for how to get through this, how to tape your feet, what shoes to wear, how to ice your feet, all that stuff. I have never had surgery and I run with it about a problem. So these are such a funny thing. 30% of people have this. I don't know what it is, why their heels hurt, why their Achilles tendons, and when they figure it out, they think they have to quit running or get surgery. It's not necessary. So those are my big on YouTube for those. Kevin Chang: What is it? And how do, how do people find out if they have it and what do they do? Vanessa Bogenholm: So if you have a shoe and you always seem to rubber area in the back of the heel, because you have a bump on your heel and it always hurts. Get an x-ray from a podiatrist. If you have a bump there it could be a type of headwinds deforming. It can be taped properly. You have to keep the swelling out of it to keep the pain down and pick the proper shoes that don't have a heel cup, and then learn not to heal struck. Cause heel striking makes it much search watch. So we work on exercises to get you off of that and to do a shorter stride that you come up in the back more, which everyone should do instead of that overreaching front stride. And then you can run with Haglund's deformity. So Galen Rupp ran with it for a decade or so. You just had surgery three years ago and had bone cut off and had to relearn how to run. Jake Riley, who was second and same deal. Gwen Jorgensen. I have won a gold medal. Same thing. These all did it. Professional runner who ran with it for decades and then had surgery later. So I do a lot of zoom calls with people that don't live here. I'm picking the right shoe, fixing their form and getting them running again. So I have people in Israel, people in Mexico who are like amazed, they can run again. Bertrand Newson: That's great. That's great. Now let's transition a bit, coach V and talk about Coach V, the author. Vanessa Bogenholm: So I think I'm trying not to talk money too much, but I got to be pretty expensive for someone people spend thousands of dollars a year for me. And I'm in a grocery store and this woman is following me around the store. Very weird. And she says, I heard you talking to your friend, do you run marathons? You're a personal trainer. You must be very expensive and she's right. And I felt bad because when I was a kid, I could never afford someone like me to help. The books I saw only had pretty people and Olympians. They didn't have average people. So how people, how to get somewhere. So I run after this woman, I tell her to drink water and whatever crap I tell her, I tell her, cause I was, even to me, I said, it's stupid. And I thought, I need to write a book about the kinds of people I help. I'm not just helping people that want to lose a hundred pounds, but I've gotten 80 year olds out of wheelchairs. I've helped kids come over, suicidal tendance. I mean, literally, I mean, through exercise, we can change you. So the book talks about all of this and the 45 year old depressed housewife, the 65 year old CEO, that drinks too much, all of it. And how we use exercise. To change them mentally and change them physically to make them happier and out of pain. That's what the book is about. It's your body move it, love it. Lift comes out September 7th. So it's been a huge project and way too many edits by the publisher. Kevin Chang: Hmmm Vanessa Bogenholm: But I'm very excited and I hope it inspires people to get moving, to find something that works and to stick with it and to get a body out of pain and to realize we own these people, take care of this body. If you buy a brand new car, you're going to wash that car and make sure the oil's changed, pay the bills on it. Take care of it, but we don't take care of these bodies. We live with them every day. You need to be comfortable in your body, which means no pain to get there. Bertrand Newson: And as we talk about pain in the year, a year in reflection. I mean, where was Coach V and the state of her business here in San Jose before. You purchased the gym in Las Vegas, in the midst of the pandemic. I remember seeing some of your social media posts around that time. Why don't you share with our audience and how you're feeling. Vanessa Bo: And, you know, I had just bought my house. I was doing probably 40 grand a year in corporate business, which means I, if you went to the San Jose convention center for a convention, your company would hire me to take you on a 5k run. So three or four times a week, I was taking people on a 5k runner around San Jose. I was doing leadership groups at Adobe and a Google and doing some exercise classes and runs speaking at seminars, and that all went away. The studios closed down and who knows what's going to happen? I had already started making videos. So I thought I could switch to zoom, but you know, maybe 60% of my clients stayed with me. The rest of them, you know, just kind of wandered away or said, we'll call you in three months when it reopens. That didn't happen, of course. And I had to re decide what I was doing started to make videos got good at making videos. The first videos are sad, but now I have the music down and all that kind of stuff. And the zoom took off. Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: I was zooming nine hours a day. Now, my accountant kept reminding me, you don't have the corporate business. What are you going to do? You have the corporate business. At that time to Veda was opening up before California and there was a boxing kickboxing gym for sale. And I bought it. Not one person said, wow, how great Vanessa, everyone has said, how stupid of you? You bought a business in the fitness world during a pandemic. It has not been easy. I love it there. I love the people I love... we have twenty-five boxing bags that we teach classes on all day long. I've also brought a yoga instructor and you know, we do other things. But it's hard and financially it's not breaking even. And stale. I'll be honest with you, but I have a great staff now. They're very fun except for the guy who didn't show up on time today. But members are really nice, but that's a very different venue. It's a, membership-based you hang out, you have fun with your friends. It's a gym. It's 5,500 square feet. It's very large. And I hope it works out. For me though. I still see the joy and the people that get to come and work out and have a great time. Now, I don't know if you guys know anything about Kickboxing, or boxing, or boxing or on the bags, but it's very fun, and everyone has a blast. It's not a violent thing. And even the guys who box it, gets together to the MMA stuff. It's all about fun. It's exercise. Kevin Chang: Yeah. I love heavy hitting a heavy bag every once in a while. I definitely enjoy it. It's a major shoulder workout. That's for sure. I mean, I think at the, for those of us that don't box on a regular basis, man, you go into it. Any given point in time and your shoulders are on fire especially coming out of it. So why boxing do you box here? Do you teach your clients how to box here? Vanessa Bogenholm: Yes, I do. I don't care how old you are, even if you're in a wheelchair we box. Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: I think it was four years ago, Gerald Washington has the heavyweight boxer and he was going for the championship. His mother was a friend of mine from tennis, and he did not have any endurance. So he spent six with me trying to learn endurance so that he could be better for this big fight. With that. I learned boxing technique at a teach boxing technique. You meant saw that kind of, so yes. Kevin Chang: incredible. Yeah. And our audience, if you haven't been to a boxing gym, I highly encourage you to go. I mean, I think the interval training as well is just fantastic. You know, getting three minutes in the one minute break, you're really teaching your body how to recover, how to, you know, how to... How to go all out and then, and then try to recover. And then you probably, your running is going to get much better after you do some of these interval training and interval rounds and teach your upper body and teach your core. I mean, there's a lot of core work that you're, you know, there's, you're punching with and a stronger core makes you a better runner as well. So it's, it's incredible. I think that's, it's a lot of fun. If you can get some of that cross training in. Vanessa Bogenholm: And I really think teenagers and young kids learning to box and getting their aggression. Kevin Chang: Hmm. Vanessa Bogenholm: really fantastic for them. I mean, I I've seen 75 year old ladies have a great time with this and think it's like the funniest thing they've ever done and wnat tto o it all the time. So yeah. Everybody loves it. Kevin Chang: Talk to us, I guess, about, you know, coming back from injury. I know we kind of glossed over this. It was 30 years between when you, you tore your Achilles and when you actually came in. I'm assuming that you weren't on the couch for 30 years. So yeah, so I mean, talk to us a little bit about, you know, some of the time in between and you know, your, your love for fitness and then getting back into running. Vanessa B: So I tore my Achilles tendon and couldn't run. I had a couple of scholarships that I lost, of course, and got my college degree was a farmer for an organic farmer for a number of years. I was jumping horses. Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: wasn't a question and went to get Olympic trials in 2004. Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: And so, yeah, I've had another sport. It's a very expensive sport. I don't recommend it for anybody, but great fun. And then literally one day I thought I had knee pain for a long time and my Achilles, I wonder if I could run. So I go out and I run a few miles and it's okay. It's not bad. And I never thought I could run heavily again, though, that just never thought that would happen and I can run maybe four miles. And then it would hurt a little bit and the Haglund's deformity would hurt. Didn't know how to take care of that. No one knew what it took care of that. And then I just started to run more and remember that child who ran and the joy that it brought me and I worked on my form, knew how to take care of my Glyn's deformity and started to run a lot more. So five years ago is when I really started to run again. That's six, I'm sorry. I'm 55 now. Shit. So yeah, when I was 49, I started running. And my goal was to do a marathon again, back to back. I don't think the rest of the races mattered. And so I ran the San Francisco marathon and when I was 50, that was the big, like I'm coming back and having stopped. Yeah. Bertrand N: Yeah, you are truly. On the move and what we mean by that is our viewers can not see what we see, but we see your, your shoe collection that is over 150 pairs of shoes. Yes. Vane: There's no addiction here. Bertrand Newson: Would you like to elaborate on shoes and the evolution of shoes? I mean, you, I know you, I love your following you on social because you're never in the same shoes twice. You did give good feedback. Vanessa : And I can tell you all the aspects of every Bertrand Newson: You can. Vanessa Bogenholm: from an aunt, from an OD to an Adidas, to a Solomon when it, whatever. Yeah. I've tried them all. Obviously companies send them. And I can tell you what works for who's kind of flip. So by going to Road Runners, which is my favorite store, and everyone there knows me and they always say the people that are helping, oh, you should ask Vanessa if she got a minute, she's really, really great. And I was got to work for your best. What are you doing? But she was all different. The most important thing is that it doesn't hurt. Do not buy a shoe by color. Look for a shoe with enough room in the toe box, right. And fits your foot and then buy a half a size bigger. Now this is the funniest thing. You should not have black toenails. You have black toe nails it's because your shoes too, too small. If you were a seven, she be a seven and a half or an eight in a running shoe. People hate to buy bigger size shoes. If you want to run on the track where spikes those hurt they're small so that's a whole different thing. But have a shoe with great support, get custom made insults. And I I'm a big believer in insults insults that come into shoes are debated. We pulled out most of the time and make sure you change your shoes. At least every 300 miles. I changed my shoes about every 150 Bertrand Newson: Great advice. Your top three favorite pair of running shoes that you're running in right now, coach. Me not top 30, top 3. Vanessa Bogenholm: Top 30. Let me see. Okay. So I run in Nike vapor fly. I prefer the older model. I got Nike to give me 10 pair. So talk about having a nice thing. I don't like the alpha flight. I think it's too bouncy and I feel silly in it. So the Nike react is what I'm using on a regular basis to Trey. If my feet hurt is the Adidas ultra boost. That's very soft all the way around. And if you have Achilles issues, there's nothing to rub on the back. The ons don't fit me. They look cool. Don't fit. They, they come in on the back on the hill. They hurt people feels a lot. Asics have a heart plastic cup in the back. Everyone's deformity. People can't wear them. The new balance is going through this weird changes of stuff where now the toe comes up. I don't know why you want a running shoe with a toe coming up. Makes no sense to me. And I think they made it a little too soft. Brooks most common running shoe. Cause it's a hundred bucks. I'm not 180 in my opinion, but guess what? It's a great all around shoe. It's not fantastic. It's great. All around. I don't like their new carbon plates. I've tried it. It's not the reactive feeling you get from the Nike. I believe if you're going to race, the Nike vapor flies with a carbon plate are necessary. They make you fat. No matter what I mean, we can't argue that one at all. When you look at other carbon plates, the Adidas. So, so I don't think it's great. The Brooks not so much, Bertrand Newson: Saucony pros? Vanessa Bogenholm: You know, Saucony has never fit my foot. I'll be honest. It's a wider cut, probably fits other people. So that's why I always liked it when I was a kid and it never fits the. Bertrand Newson: Okay. Thank you for that feedback. Great insight. Kevin Chang: About Hokas. Do you, have you ran Hokas or? Vanessa: God, can't stand Hokas. Ok. If you are a heavier set person, I can put you in Hokas because it's such an even shoe, but it does not encourage you to bend your knee and bring your leg up in the back. So it puts most people in a very strange pattern of almost wigging their leg out. When they run, you're going to be faster. You get the smaller Hokas, which are more like a regular traditional running shoe. And those are fantastic. I actually have a pair of those and the carbon plate that Allah gave me and signed me signed form for me. Yep. So I actually did one wash, one race. What are some of those. But that's a different kind of Hoka than you normally see people in, but you see people in Hocus, they do this kind of shuffle run thing. That's, I don't think it's good on your knees on a lighter in later time. My opinion. Bertrand Newson: And we over the last probably month and a half Kevin and myself and another one of our members of the RaceMob admin team Scott's rule had a gear podcast and other than shoes, which you clearly are expert on what are some other pieces of gear that you recommend new runners from a recovery as well? Recovery tools? Vanessa Bogenholm: I use ice packs that are made for my feet. They'd come from the king brown King brand. It's an old company that makes bell Crow, boots, or Velcro, neat things with ice packs that fit around the joints have been in the freezer. Take them out, put them in the boat, the ice packs last five or six years. Fantastic. So the King brand, I recommend them every which way KT tape is my go-to tape. I have other companies send me tape all the time. KT tape will last me through a run. Even if I throw water on myself the whole time, it doesn't come off. You would need to figure out your antitrust shaving solution. Chafing is the worst and it will happen to everybody. And if you've ever gotten a shower, And cried, there you go. Figure out your anti chafing ointment. There's lots of them out there. Trail toes is amazing and it stays on forever. We use whatever. There's also great. Silicone one out of Germany have used love it. Okay. Do you carry water or don't you? So this is a very preferential thing. I do not run with water when I go on 12 mile training runs. I do not use water in a race. I take water, but I do not take carry water with myself. When I run, I do have a vest. I do have a Nathan vest. I never use it. That's just me. All of my clients. I may carry a water anytime over eight miles, you carry water. Don't listen to Vanessa. So that's very different. If you were going to run more than eight miles, figure out the goo you can eat, or if you can take raisins with you, what are you going to do? Like do you get a little bit of food in you. You're going to marathon. How are you going to get through that? You have to practice that on a regular basis. I use a belt clip for my phone. I clip it on the back of my shorts. It doesn't bounce thrilled with it. I do not carry it in my hands. I use beats headphones because beats headphones do not get damaged by water and sweat. And they last me for years and they great sound not to hear myself breathe, which is wonderful. Make sure your clothes fit do not get a fancy new outfit and wear the day of the race. Wash it at least three times before you wear it. The first time when you run in it, cut off all the techs, chafing, chafing, chafing, chafing. Right? So these are things you need to do to run running is not cheap. Obviously look at my shoes. So But you really need to get good care and take the time to put into getting the good gear and not just thinking somebody go out the door and run. Bertrand Newson: Great feedback. Great feedback. Yep. Kevin Chang: I did want to get into one story, you know of you guys talked before we went on air about, about Ingrid and kind of her journey and just wanting to get into let's you kind of kick it off Vanessa, about, about Ingrid. We're just getting to know about her journey and and her story a little bit. Vanessa B: So Ingrid is amazing. She's lost. I think it's 156 pounds more than herself. And Ingrid's doing it as, as a streaker. She started to run and it has not stopped. And she's fantastic. And she's running about a 2 0 5 half marathon, half marathon right now. We're doing our first marathon at Santa Rosa. So, you know, shooting for about a 4:54 and 14 to 14. And doing it without major injury, which is impossible as you know, and she's really good when I was with her about getting her to slow down and not hurt herself, that when you're hurt you don't run through it. You could walk a couple miles and take that rest of the day off. And then come back. It's really important not to kill yourself because you're so obsessed with getting somewhere, whether it be running a marathon or losing weight or whatever it may be. Remember that this body took a long time to get to whatever level you were at and take a long time to get it where you want it to be. And, you know, she's great at taking advice and she takes it to heart if she doesn't like it and still does it. She's great. So I would imagine she's the 15th or 20th. Client I'd had lose over 60 pounds and take two races. So it's amazing when you see somebody lose this weight, cross that finish line and the smile they have because they never thought they could do that. That's what's amazing about races. 5k is in 10 K and watch them finish. So I had a man who was a cardiologist at Stanford and just moved to Sacramento last year, but I was giving a talk or a seminar. And I said, you know, 70% of the people are either overweight or obese and it excluded this room of cardiologists. And I gave this guy in the front row. I said, give me two numbers. And he was basically rose back and rose sideways and asked that person to stand up. And it was this cardiologist who was 70 to 80 pounds overweight. And I said, I was getting paid 500 bucks to talk. I didn't care what people thought. How do you tell people not to have a heart attack when you're obese? And he was like, you have room for another client. And the whole room laughed. Kevin Chang: Yeah. Vanessa Bogenholm: And he became my client Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: And I made him have his first 5k. Stanford five K Kevin Chang: Wow. Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: When he lost 50 pounds, he had to live, run his 5k at work in front of everybody who knew him. And he cried when he finished, Because he was so amazed and he's healthy. Now, he was a cardiologist who was overweight, so anyone could do it. And he never wanted to run. I love that when people say I don't want to run Vanessa, whatever. Kevin Chang: I mean, so many of us or in that boat, like hated running, never thought about running and sometimes you do need that hard truth. Right? I think sometimes people call it like the I think Tim Ferriss calls it the Harijuku moment. You needed some switch to happen to your brain in order to get yourself out of your comfortable lifestyle, to get yourself a little bit uncomfortable, to get yourself to commit a little bit, and then a roadmap and a plan on what to do next, how am I going to get there, to get a support system that's going to get you there as well. And it sounds like, I mean, you've done this time and time and time again. For a number of different clients. And just getting that swish, just getting that, that initial motivation, just getting that support. I mean, it's just incredible. It's incredible to hear about these success stories one after another, after another it gets me inspired. I mean, the book, I can't wait to pick it off. I can't wait to read it because I mean, these inspirational stories. Want to make sure, make you get up off the couch and you know, there's no excuse. There's really no excuse to not move forward and try your best and do a little bit better than you did yesterday. So I love that. I love, yeah, I love all. Vanessa Bogenholm: There's one thing, there's one thing we're forgetting. So me and Bertrand, our friends on weekends, we're not even during the week friends, we are friends who see each other at races and go, Hey, how's it going on? When you go to races on a regular basis in Northern California, you see 20 to 30% of the people that are your friends. So when this pandemic happened, we weren't seeing our friends anymore. That was awful. This is our social life. We don't go to bars. We're not bowling. We hang out at races and take pictures together. It doesn't matter if you were the back of the pack or the front of the pack, you get the same banana, same bottle of water, and we give same hugs. So this is our tribe and we missed this horribly. So that's why it's so exciting to go to races again. Kevin Chang: Yeah. What races do you have on your calendar? What, where are you heading to. Vanessa Bogenholm: Well, okay. That's a great question. So I told you, I saw Frank Shorter again after a number of years. So he is now my personal coach. Kevin Chang: Wow. Wow. Bertrand Newson: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: Delightful. He's delightful, but there's only glory in three things, the 100, the one mile and the marathon. And so he's telling me to make a decision to stop running everything. And I just did a 5k on the track and won fastest I've ever run. I ran my first mile under seven minutes as you know, a 55 year old woman. That's ridiculous. So obviously it's painful. There's a case of you in Paris running in that left leg is wild. Kevin Chang: Okay. Vanessa Bogenholm: The marathon always has that special place because I don't care what you do when you finish. You're just like, wow. The half marathon is comfortable. It's a comfortable race. I feel like I did something, but I don't hurt that much. When I race them hard the 10 K was always my favorite length. That was always my favorite race, but there's no glory of 10K. So. I don't know what I'm doing, basically. I'm trying to tell you, I, I, now back in the seventies and eighties, eighties, all the men ran all the distances, right? Everything long distance was a mile up to the marathon. All they all ran it as a 55 year old woman who works with three companies. I can't do it all. Don't tell anybody, but I can't. And I do want to touch on my thing cause we didn't talk on my 33rd company. I have a nonprofit exercise in the streets and so we give running shoes, sweatshirts, toiletry bags, and a duffel bag with also has some cash in it. Every foster child in Santa Clara county and in Clark county, we used to, before the pandemic do running clinics in juvenile hall. Kevin Chang: Wow. Vanessa Bogenholm: So I went back on my birthday, did juvenile hall for the first time in a year and a half. It's fantastic. And it's amazing. So of the kids who've gotten backs one of them is now on a full ride on SAC state, which is just delightful. Another one. I got him a full ride scholarship to St. Francis school. So meet him, got him transferred and got him a full ride. So I don't know all the things I do. Helping those kids is priceless and occasionally I'll be somewhere and I'll see a kid carrying one of the bags. And I can't say hello, because that would be taking their anonymity away as a foster child. But I was like, wow, look at the shoes. So it's not really that unusual that I would give a nonprofit that was running shoes and all the running shoes are over a hundred dollars in every way. So Adidas gives me shoes. Nike gives me shoes. People have been more than generous, and we were very lucky. I think right now a little over 3000 kids have gotten bags. So yes, it's, it's crazy. And I have to tell you, we first started, so I have kids that went to, you know, Bellarmine's. Sorry, Toga and let's get us high school. I wanted them to see the world I was from and I knew Sergeant and I said, can we do a run clinic at juvie hall? And he said, sure, come on in. And then I said, let's take some shoes. We went literally to the Nike outlet, bought a bunch of shoes, took shoes. Right. So that's how it kind of started and it's grown from there. So that's great. Kevin Chang: That's incredible. That's incredible. And as we've mentioned before, you're working with three different organizations right now. So http: //TrainWithV.com, http://fitness23.fIt, and http: //ExerciseOnTheStreet.com. I mean, this has been just an incredible conversation. Where can our audience find you online? I know that you have a social media presence. Please let our audience know how they can reach out to you. Vanessa Bogenholm: Sure. So http: //TrainWithV.com, you know, @_fitness23. That's my Instagram Vanessa Bogenholm. You can find me on Facebook, around LinkedIn and Train with V, this is how you're going to find me on YouTube. And there's all the free videos there. Haglund's deformity, video, anything. And [email protected]. That's how you can email me anytime. I've never had an email. I didn't answer. You know, I always feel privileged that people want my help. I give just like both of you probably do hours and hours of free advice. I mean, I found myself helping a guy that was overweight in Lucky's grocery store at the register who looked at me and said, I have a weight problem. What do I do? And I thought, okay, do this, do this, do this. I mean, you know, that's just people look at me and ask me questions. Now that's a gift. I never think of it as a burden. And I always try to be polite. Even though I make a living at this, I have to give it away or else it's not special to be either. You're welcome. Kevin Chang: Incredible. Incredible. Thank you again so much, Coach V really appreciated this, this entire hour. Vanessa Bogenholm: Thanks guys. Have a nice night. Kevin Chang: This has been fantastic. Well, I hope you enjoyed this episode of the RaceMob podcast. Check out all of the show notes or find a running buddy online at RaceMob dot com. Please subscribe to us on apple, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to your podcasts and leave us a review until next time. Keep on moving.