Hydration Tips from the Inventor of the Hydroshirt - Vessel Athletics Founder Jasmine Sanchez

Jasmine Sanchs: And you know, really what the book kind of talked about was how business can actually create change in the world. It's not just all about revenue, revenue. It can actually great, you know, social good kind of coined the term as we know today, social entrepreneurship. And so that, like I said, just really changed my perception around what I want to do and not just start a business to kind of make a livelihood, but I also want to make impact. Kevin Chang: Hello and welcome to the RaceMob podcast. This is episode number 66. I'm Kevin entrepreneur technology and fitness nerd. And I'm joined by the head coach of RaceMob and master motivator, the incomparable Bertrand Newson. Hey, there RaceMob crew. On today's episode, we have an entrepreneur and the founder of Vessel Athletics. Jasmine Sanchez. Jasmine is working on bringing in innovative new product market. The hydro shirt. As an endurance athlete, we all know the importance of staying hydrated during those long activities, but many of today's solutions are cumbersome or can cause chaffing. Jasmine saw this pain point and is actually doing something about it. In today's episode, we go behind the scenes on how this entrepreneur got her start, and how she's taking it from concept to prototype, plus what she's learned along the way. Jasmine also gives us some of her best hydration tips and tells us how we can support her endeavor. All of the show notes can be found online at RaceMob.com/podcast. And without further ado, here's our conversation. Bertrand: Hello, RaceMob family. We're very fortunate to have Ms. Jasmine Sanchez with Vessel Athletics. Entrepreneur, founder, and an avid runner. Who's also in the midst of training for her very first marathon. Welcome, Jasmine. Jasmine Sanchs: Thank you. Thank you. Coach "B" and Kevin for having. Kevin Chang: Awesome. Well, I mean, Jasmine, why don't we go ahead and dive into your athletic adventures and the endeavors. When did you get into running? Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. So I got into running probably a little bit over five years ago. And it started during my time in college and the reason why I got into running, it was not because I was crazy fast, talented athlete. I did not, I was, I hated running to be honest, but I love sports. I love sports all my life. I grew up playing basketball. And then when I entered college after high school I attended San Jose state and my, my former university was known more as a commuter school. So it didn't really, I would say kind of lack that community, especially that first semester when you're kind of coming into a new place or adjusting and you know, but that one thing that stayed consistent was that fiscal activity. And so. Yeah, I was going to the gym at the time, but not really meeting anyone. And then I came across this 5k that it was happening and I think it was hosted by run local in the bay area. And I just decided to sign up. I was like, Hey, what the heck? Let's see what happens. Let's see, you know this is my first 5k and kind of through that initial experience. You know, the training process, the process that went into kind of preparing for my first 5k ever the day of the race day, those, you know, excitement, that excitement that was jitters and then being there, around so many other people were cheering you on bands playing it's just so that environment, it was kind of addicting and it just kind of spiraled down. Love for running, which is kind of weird how, you know, initially started off hating it. And now here I am today as still an avid runner as Coach "B" said training for my first marathon starting a brand in the running space and doing a lot of other things. You know, my, my passion is in the running industry. I want to, I want to be here forever. Bertrand Newson: Yeah. That's, that's fantastic. Let's go back to that very first 5k. And what did the training look like for you, Jasmine? Jasmine Sanchs: Gosh, it's so long ago... Bertrand Newson: What did it look like? Jasmine Sanchs: What, what did it, I would say a lot of treadmill running. Not honestly, not, not much thought went into, it was just like, Hey, I don't really, this is my first time. I think I just need to run. Right. I mean, luckily at that time I was, you know, I didn't, I was healthy. I didn't have any injuries. Right now I'm kind of going through an injury or overcoming an injury. And then I've, I mean, I've always been active. So honestly, that, that initial 5k was just kind of being consistent, getting you know, my steel and my stamina. That's kind of how it looked like, but honestly, and this is something that I think a lot of first-time runners kind of run into. Where the heck am I going to get all these resources from like, how am I going to learn how to do this first race? It's not, you know, you, sometimes it's kind of hard to know where to go. So I think I was in that, in that boat, from what I recall. Kevin Chang: I think so many of our audience, and I certainly remember my very first time, my very first. And that, that feeling, that feeling of euphoria, the feeling of excitement it's being around other people. Do you remember what the course was? You said it was maybe a rumble cool event. Do you think It was. for a week? Okay. Do you think it was downtown San Jose Jasmine Sanchs: It was. Yeah. Yeah. So actually I think it wasn't eight K. So it was Santana row, downtown San Jose, the 401k you know, they had. The mariachi playing on the side as you know, and I was doing it alone and I went there alone and, oh, I remember they were giving out these sports drinks and I like left with a box filled with them. I was like, this is awesome. Free stuff, music. Yeah. That was the first race. Kevin Chang: Wow. Well, yeah. I have loved the 401k ever since I think the inception of it and in Coach "B" and I both have very, very fond memories of the four-week hay over the years. So that is fantastic. And then transitioned that into, Yeah. Now starting your own business vessel athletics. so, where did the idea come from? How did you get started? How are these going? Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah, so lots to dive in there. Kevin Chang: Okay. Jasmine Sanchs: let me take it back a little bit, kind of, to. That's kind of, when I initially knew I wanted to start my own thing one day you know, fortunate enough to have grown up around a household of entrepreneurs. My parents were small business owners and so at a very early age I was like, you know, I want to start a business. I just didn't know what it was at the time. You know, then around age, maybe 12, 13, I read this book that kind of changed my whole perception around business and what business meant. And it was start something that matters by Blake Koskie. I think that's how you say his last name. He's a founder of Toms. And you know, really what the book kind of talked about was how business can actually create change in the world. It's not just all about revenue, revenue. It can actually great, you know, social good kind of coined the term as we know today, social entrepreneurship. And so that, like I said, just really changed my perception around what I want to do and not just start a business to kind of make a livelihood, but I also want to make impact. And so I knew that I really, really early age in high school kind of dabbled in different forms of social impact, social good. Didn't really know. And then of course, you know, college came got into running at that time. And as I was working my way up to do these longer distances, that's, you know, around that time is when I was like, okay, well I need to, I need to start thinking about my hydration practices. You know, I sweat probably more than most people. And so, especially for me, like, you know, in a couple of miles in, I would start feeling really thirsty. You know, I think a lot of runners go through this phase where they kind of plateau, they're kind of hitting a wall. They're feeling a little fatigued throughout their running journey. Maybe a couple months, sometimes it lasts. And so. You know, I was doing this research figuring out, okay. Yeah, it is, you know, maybe I do need to kind of be a little bit more thoughtful on my hydration. So I turned to hydration products. What can I use to carry water on my runs? And kind of went through this process of trying out a bunch of different hydration products from your the grip water bottles, the hydration, backpacks, the water belts, et cetera, and found issues with a lot of them. Honestly, it's just, even to this day, I think it's a lot of the products are uncomfortable. They're heavy. You know, I don't want to be holding something in my hand, the entire run flimsy, very unstable. And so, you know, I was through this process, I just thought, you know, by this point I had wasted a lot of time. A lot of money had bad experiences on particular races, particular runs with these products. And so I just thought, honestly, you can, I, I. Come up with something better. And it was cool because around the same time I was taking some of these entrepreneurship classes in college. And so the number one thing they said is, you know, before you build something, go out, speak to runners. And so there I went, I went off, you know, in San Jose, going to races every weekend to local trails, going up to runners who had hydration, backpacks asking them, Hey, what do you like about this? What do you not like, why are you using it? Eventually, what do you think of this idea, et cetera, and, you know eventually found out I'm not the only one who is unsatisfied with these hydration products. And so what I also found out too, is that a lot of runners actually don't really prioritize hydration way the way they should be prioritizing it. And so you know, long story short. That's kind of the light bulb moment. You know, I came up with idea like, what if we could just put one of those hydration, flatters inside of an athletic wear shirt and you know, that can, we can stabilize it. It'd be lighter than a backpack. We don't have to hold a bottle in our hand. And then just, boom. You know, I just kind of literally ran with the idea, have been working on it since. And it's been a very long time coming years of development up and down puddles, which I can dive more into like the design process if we want to get into that. But yeah. You know, still working to this day on it and you know, I'm realizing that like not only is my job to create a better hydration product, but it's also to actually help educate runners, provide more hydration resources really spread the message of like hydration education. Kevin Chang: Okay. Incredible. So, so talk to us a little bit, you know, when you're talking to customers or potential customers about, you know, the problems that they're having with their current backpacks, what are some of the things that you're looking to solve? And you're looking to solve with these prototypes? So it looks like stability being one of them, you know, the, the backpack kind of sloshing around and maybe shaping or causing some, some issues when you're pairing something of that size or that weight. What, what are potentially some of the other things that you're looking at? Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. I mean, I think you kind of hit the most important one, which is like stability. And you know, stability is one of the things, the biggest complaints that many. Talk about you know, earlier this year I put together a very long list of running retailers and I called a bunch of them across America and asked them, what are your renters coming in for like around these hydration products. And that was one of the most common things is like, you know, a lot of these right. They sometimes opt for the water bottles because it's just so much instability comfort, overall comfort. Another surprising thing that I asked that came from talking to these people was that some of these hydration, bests, these backpacks, they're not designed for you know, I don't even want to say plus size, but I can't think of a, for lack of a better word plus size runners. They're designed for these very thin lean runners that you kind of see in a lot of marketing in a lot of these brands marketing. And so like women with larger bus in particular. They it's very uncomfortable. Like these desks, these hydration, backpacks they're, you know, they don't allow for much, you know, breathability basically. And so that was another interesting thing that came to mind. And so all these pieces of feedback that I'm picking up where, you know, thinking about how that's impacting our own design, too. Kevin Chang: That's great. And, and so, I mean, I guess talk to us a little bit about going from idea to prototype and, you know, this is a physical product, so this is, you know, not the easiest thing sometimes to get off the ground and get started. So what was that process like and how did it go? Jasmine Sanchs: Well, that process is still going, certainly not over by any means, which is kind of frustrating, honestly, but I'm here. I'm going to be fully transparent, you know, like that this process of designing has been a nightmare at times, but you know, I'm still going. Basically, you know, once you come up with idea, you, like you said, you'd go into the prototyping phase and you kind of try and get out what they call an MVP, a minimum viable. Products and. That's just creating anything, anything that looked that's kind of functional functionable so that you can just test it out and just see if this is, this can work. And so I remember, you know, I, I, by the way, don't have any design experience whatsoever. So I, you know, what I did is I found the students. Didn't even have apparel design experience, but he was an industrial design student on campus and he kind of helped with those initial prototypes. And then I found a seamstress in San Jose actually, and, you know, seamstress, they're not qualified, they're not necessarily qualified to do prototypes, but she was, she's a very talented seamstress. And so she kind of helped with more iterations of the project. And then, you know, then came once you kind of have something physical, you're able to test it on yourself, on other runners, get feedback figure out what works, what doesn't that's when you know, the, the importance of working with an actual designer comes into play. So we've actually worked with three designers to date. We're currently working with one right now and going through the process of making it. So changes to this day and kind of where we are right now. So we're going to be doing you know, producing overseas. So we're in the midst of finding a factory, which is, you know, kind of been another uphill battle. We're also working with a production manager to help with the communication facilitation of these factories and all that. And so basically how it goes is like, you know, we get a prototype, we get a sample from a factory. We do testing. Fortunately run into some issues. Oh, they missed this. We had to send that feedback, feedback back, and then we have to unfortunately wait, like three months, even get something else. That's kind of been the process very, very slow. And just, you know, honestly it's just patience is, is what it comes down to and not rushing this product. Kevin Chang: That makes sense. Yeah. And you know, I mean, I think your first prototypes are always something that it'll take a little while to get up and running, but when you find something that people really enjoy and people really love, and you're able to iterate on that, you know, a time where to. Really the sky's the limit for the number of physical products that runners will test, we'll try, we'll buy. So I think you're in a very good market. And I think it's a really interesting novel concept. So, so tell us a little bit about why a shirt or why placing a bladder inside a shirt? And I guess your initial prototypes, were you taking kind of off the shelf bladders and then like off the sell shirts and, and putting kind of a, I mean, I guess, talk to me a little bit about those initial prototypes that how'd you even build them. Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. I really like how you're kind of diving into the, kind of the deep nitty gritty details of like design, because gosh, I was so ignorant to the design process of what it takes to create the shirts that we're wearing right now, honestly. Answering your first question. Why a shirt? Why apparel? Well, number one, like you said, it's novel, but the other thing too was, you know, obviously one of the constraints with the current options is the weight. You know, our, the design that we're you know, working with the hydro shirt, that's about. Roughly three to five pounds up to seven pounds lighter than, you know, your standard hydration backpack. So if you're doing these long distances, that can make a huge difference. Especially if you have back problems, things like. Then the other component too, is just it's not so bulky too. So it's, you know, it's it's in the form of a shirt, so that's kind of, that was the idea. There is like, how can I make a product that is just, that starts off being lightweight. But also like, we're, we're really trying to focus on the stability component, which honestly that's been the hardest part. I have a lot of respect for these other products because these other designers who are designing these products, cause it's really hard. Find that perfect solution that stabilizes the pack and yeah. Yeah. To answer your second question is when we were starting off. Yeah. We were always just buying off the shelf water bladders, seeing what I could find most water bladders online, or like, or if the store, you know, two liters or more. So it was kind of, we're doing, we're starting off with a 32. Hydration pack. So it was hard to find something that size. At one point, I even bought this PVH plastic and this I don't even know the word for it, but this a heat machine. And I, you know, cut out my own hydration packs. I steal them together. I mean, I tried, you just have to be creative and try anything you can think of, honestly. Kevin Chang: That's awesome. Is it modular? Do you do buy the shirt and the pack together? Or can you buy multiple shirts, multiple packs and switch them in and out? How does the I get, how, how do you envision that? Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So the, of course we haven't launched yet, but the idea is to actually launch on Kickstarter first, that's going to be kind of our soft launch. And so when we do initially launch, we are planning on selling the package. Together as a, as a whole we'll probably be lunching with several different color ways of the shirt, but really we're starting off with a t-shirt for both men and women. So it's, you know, of course, different sizing as well. But the long-term vision is really, you know, expanding this to be a full apparel hydration brand is kind of the best way to put it. So offering different lines of active wear tops, you know, Long sleeves t-shirts you know, it's technical apparel is kind of what it, what it's called. And so the idea is like, Hey, you, you know, eventually you can buy our apparel and then any hydration pack you buy from us is universal to our apparel. That's kind of the idea there. And it's, it's, it's challenging again, you know, but that, yeah, that's the longterm vision. Bertrand Newson: And Jasmine, is there a comparable, I mean, outside of a hydration vest right now and backpacks. And is there anything out there that mimics like a running shirt that with some hydration embedded in it that you, you know, you've seen it or that are trying to move the needle? Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. So that's a really, really good you know, question because I feel like over the last couple of years, there's been a lot of movement in the space, you know, people are catching on. It's my idea. So I gotta move quick. But about three years ago, this popular snowboarding brand. I believe it's 6, 8, 6. That's how you say it. It's not the other way around. I use their products, but they launched a, a snowboarding jacket called I believe the hydro stash. And, and so this was already once I was working on the hydro shirt and I was like, oh, this is so cool. But this actually validates the fact that there is a need for better hydration products among endurance sports. So that was one thing that just really validated the idea. And then actually more so recently there has been I believe Nathan's sports started doing, I saw like they came out with some shorts in where you can put like one of the little water bottles, the shorts kind of the back area things like that, kind of these one-off products, some of these brands that have been established for a long time are doing these one-off products. Interestingly enough, is that a lot of these brands don't kind of prioritize apparel. What I learned, I spoken to some like sales reps or people on like the retail space. So that's been interesting, but yeah, I honestly think it is kind of an interesting time. Like there's a lot of innovation going on in the hydration space. So we want to be the sole focus. Like we want to be focused on hydration and apparel from day one, though. Kevin Chang: I love it. Yeah. And I, and I love the idea. I mean, I think you, you are taking this concept of, you know, Reducing the amount of weights on a runner's back by removing that whole backpack element, you are removing kind of the straps and everything that could cause chafing along the way. And just because the shirt already has all of these points of contact with the body. So if you can figure out the stability elements, spread that bladder weights You know, the, the weight of the shirt itself. I think you you'll probably have something here. And so, Yeah. probably seeing is believing. What has been the feedback from those who have tested it the prototypes and So some of those initial tests that you did. Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. So it's actually. Kind of a while since we got some recent testing is like right now, we're kind of in the process of waiting for some new samples to come in. But the overall feedback, so, and again, me being transparent, there's been good and bad feedback. Start off with the bad is that I, as I mentioned earlier, one of the biggest hurdles has been figuring out the stability issue, which is our most important thing. So, you know, at one point the, we ran into the issue where the hydration pack sits on the back, just like a backpack. And unfortunately it was kind of dragging the shirt up. So there was like a, the, a pool from the back and, you know, the neck area was kind of uncomfort. So that was like, oh, okay. We need to go back to the drawing board, fix that. And so now we're kind of working a little redesign, can try and incorporate like a vest. That's kind of the best way to put it, like a harness in the form of the shirt, but it's still a shirt it's so hard to describe you know, over purse or through words. But, so that's kind of, you know, that was all really good feedback. Good positive feedback that helped us iterate on our design. Now positive feedback that people really liked was we've incorporated an installation lining inside of the pouch that actually helps keep the water cooler for a longer period. We had this really cool magnet component, which is like basically in the front of the shirt a little bit in the shoulder area, close to the shoulder area. And so I don't know if you've seen, but a lot of the hydration backpacks, they they have like, they're there, they stick on with like this clip, but it's kind of. Not, not the easiest thing to pull on and off. And so we've incorporated this magnet. That's just so easy. You just snap it on, drink water, snap it back into place. You could probably even let go of it. And it just snaps back into place very easily. So just very small features that like we've put a lot of thought and effort into. The other thing too, that we were looking at is, you know, going back to how many of these best hydration backpacks are designed for, you know, very thin and lean, right. Thinking about how can we make this design a little bit more inclusive to runners of all different shapes and sizes? That's something that I, I really want to hone in on whether it's, you know, in this initial design or later down the line, but very early on, I think in the brand, I really want to hone in on that because I, I mean, I meet renters of all different levels, sizes, backgrounds. And so I, I want to create, you know, accessible products for, for all different types of. Kevin Chang: That's great. And I'm so glad that you're doing the testing that you're incorporating feedback. I mean, I think the, the back of the shirt kind of pulls back. That's not something I would have even thought. So the fact that you're thinking about Yeah. the internal structures of the sure. Trying to redesign so that you can again, have multiple touch points on the body and make sure that it's a comfortable running experience. I think that's excellent. And and it kudos to you because it's not easy and it's not cheap to get these initial prototypes up and going and, you know, getting your idea off the ground so that. Extreme kudos to you to getting to this point. And, you know, I think you really do have some something here on your hands. So anything that we can do to help you get this out and to the public we're absolutely here to do, and I wanted to switch gears just a bit. Cause you mentioned you felt like it wasn't just your job to put innovative products out into the market, but it was also your job to help educate runners and endurance athletes especially about the needs for hydration. So. Going into this, or what have you learned? What are some of the topics? What are some of the trends? What are some of the potential mistakes that runners make? When it comes to hydration, Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. So, you know, kind of, kind of tying in. Well segwaying into hydration. I think many of the times when we're feeling, you know, fatigue, we kind of bog, we cross for hitting that wall. And we're not, we don't know what's going on. And sometimes this happens over the course of several days, weeks, months, oftentimes it's because we're dehydrated. And so, you know, I, like I said earlier, I want to make sure that dehydration is no longer an issue for any runner. You know, that it's a top of every runner's priority. And right now I find that most of the information is very cookie cutter. It's very generic. You know, if you go on Google right now, you'll probably you type in how much water should I be drinking as a runner. You're probably gonna find some resources that just tell you, you should be drinking X amount of water during if you're running X amount of minutes and it doesn't, it just doesn't consider so many other options. Factors, I would say the number one factor is your sweat rate, how much water you're losing per hour. And so, as I mentioned earlier, for me personally, I sweat a lot more than maybe the average person. And so that means that that number is going to be very different from someone else who sweats differently, you know? So I think. Kind of the, one of the biggest things is just not taking, not, not taking that cookie cutter approach. There's a lot of other things that play a role into how our hydration or sweat rate. So the other thing is like the temperature that we're running in, you know, obviously our, our sweat rates actually going to change in the summer versus the winter. In many cases you know, the layer of clothing that we have, the gear that we have, you know, of course the more layers that we have, you know, that that's going to obviously increase our sweat rate. If you have non breathable clothing, that's gonna, you know, make you sweat more, the color of your urine, the amount, you know, frequency are you, and this is another big important one is like, are you starting off your runs already? Dehydrated? That's known as cumulative dehydration. So, you know, just say I run on Monday. I, you know, am I run? And I don't really replenish what I lost during that run. Tuesday comes, I go about my day, the evening comes and I'm ready to start my run, but I didn't even do a good job at replenishing. You know what I lost the day before? Well, I'm starting that runoff dehydrated, and I think that's a lot more common than we think. It's just not that we're not thinking about. How much water did we lose during that run yesterday? So that means I need to be drinking what I lost, basically. So that's another important one. And then I would just say another one that comes to mind is, are you incorporating electrolytes into the mix? You know, some runners don't and that's okay. Kind of, depending on like the distance that you're running, but also, you know, if you are a heavy sweater, if you're a salty sweater, definitely usually recommended to incorporate some electrolytes into the mix. And So kind of just circling back. I think one of the most important things to do around hydration is figure out how much water you're losing. What's your sweat rate per hour. And typically what's recommended among researchers that myself, I'm not a researcher. I've just kind of read tons of different resources. And what's recommended is to replenish anywhere from 80 to a hundred percent of what you lost during your run, or at least. Kevin Chang: If you like our podcast and sign up for our newsletter, where we give you weekly tips on how to run your best race and have fun in the process, just go to RaceMob dot com and sign up today. Bertrand Newson: How can runners, as it's, as you mentioned, the most important component is understanding of sweat rate. How can a, an everyday runner understand how to measure their own uniques? Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. So funny, you mentioned that. So there's, there's actually the scientific calculation that I found on a scientific journal. I think that's what they're called. You know, if you go on Google scholar, you'll probably find it, which is, you know, so basically there's a science. Formula that many researchers recommend you put, you know, your numbers in and outcomes, your sweat rate. And so I had to find that through, you know, a Google scholar report, which is probably not the best way to be sharing that information. And so I was finding all this like very helpful information like that. And I decided to. You know, create it, put it into the form of an ebook, a hydration, ebook, a guide which I like. Well, I mentioned before that we started the podcast that I released that last week. So it's free. Whoever's listening. If you want access to it, you can just download it very easy. And I actually created a spreadsheet where you can just, basically, it's very easy. You just pump in your numbers. So what you'll be putting in is your starting weight before your run, your end rate, after your run, how long your ran, the amount of water you drink. Couple of other things as well and outcomes, your sweat rate per hour. And it's going to, you know, it's very easy. I, I tried to make that process as easy as possible. And so one other thing too, I'll recommend is whether you decide to use through that spreadsheet, or, you know, you decide to take the science, you decide to find it on Google scholar. I actually recommend tracking over the course of 14 days just to get that average. So you can average out your sweat. Per hour, because some days, you know, your, your sweat, rate's gonna fluctuate on depending on other factors. And so I recommend to actually do it over the course of X amount of days, just so you can get the average. But that's just, you know, I'll definitely, I talk about that as well in the ebook. And in the spreadsheet, Kevin Chang: Awesome. We'll definitely have links online to the spreadsheet and to the ebook for anybody, any of our listeners who wants to go ahead and download these super helpful resources. And what I love you mentioning is that sweat rate is so individual, right? So it does depends on you and your specific body and Yeah. If you're in a form of chronic dehydration, like so many of us are then that is something that takes time to actually rehydrate your body. It can take weeks if not, months to really get your yourself up to a state of full hydration. So it's definitely something to take a look at and something to see, you know, in your daily life. How can you. Are you drinking enough water in your daily life and how can you kind of increase that rate? Over time I wanted to dive into a couple of more things as we get into hydration one we recently had a guest on Brian, Frank from hammer nutrition, and he mentioned that his philosophy is less, is more philosophy that oftentimes we try to overcompensate sometimes and hydration being one of those things as well. So he admitted. Sometimes we think, oh, we just need to hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. And we actually over hydrate where sometimes pulls nutrients out of the body makes you actually have to urinate more frequently and that's actually detrimental to your runs as well. So, I mean, I guess talk to us about, you know, how once you've figured out that sweat rates w how do you use that in terms of on the go hydration or running? What are some of the tips that you might have for our audience? Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah, that's a very good point. And I definitely mentioned that kind of early on in the ebook, which is like, Hey, you know, make sure you're not over hydrating either. That's not good as well. So once you are able to kind of figure out what your sweat rate per hour is. As I mentioned earlier, what's kind of recommended is that, you know, once you figure that out, it's nice to try and replenish that about 80% of what you lost during your run. And so once you have that number, you know, you shouldn't necessarily be. Drinking more than that number. I mean that, that's definitely not recommended. Of course you, you definitely want to make sure that you're not over drinking. So that's why that number is so important. It's extremely important to figure out how much you're drinking. And again, kind of going back to the generic cookie cutter answers. It's like if I don't sweat as much, if my sweat rate is maybe lower than the average person. You know, I might be drinking more water than what's recommended, you know, so just, but that's why it's so important to figure out what that number is with that target number. Kevin Chang: That's great. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And, you know, I think again, don't try to play. You know, if you're realizing you're an hour into your run and you haven't quite drank all everything for the, for your sweat rate, don't try to drink it all at once. Try to drink them every 10 minutes and increments. And that's why, you know, having like the tube in your shirt and just being able to pull it, take a quick sip. The why that's so nice to have so readily. Bertrand Newson: I think timing is everything. I mean, we're talking right now in the midst of summer, it's warmer right now. And Jasmine, as much as you're training for your first marathon, we have several of our athletes that are training for half marathons and marathons. In fact, are. Santa Rosa this weekend where the temperatures are expected to be in the mid to high eighties. So people will be sweating more and hydration is particularly important. And if you don't have a good hydration and nutrition game pump is certainly hydration. It can, it can unravel all the endurance that you've worked hard for. If the hydration plan isn't well thought out. So is there anything I know it's, you know, we're all different shapes and sizes, but for a half marathon or a marathon distance in warmer temperatures warmer is all relative. So if we're looking at something in a plus 80 degrees, not as much humidity as the east coast and the south Southeast any tips that you can give our list or some takeaways, I mean, you're a runner yourself. You know, you're going to be looking, you're looking at a, was it CIM, California international marathon in December. All right. And you'll have a a hydration game plan a little bit cooler during that time of the year versus where we're at right now. And we're people will be running in the wine country any, you know, two or three tips that be useful for runners. Jasmine Sanchs: this is not, maybe not directly answering your question, but I. You know, I definitely recommend doing this process of figuring out what your sweat rate is twice a year, you know, once in the summer, once in the winter, because you know, temperature, as I mentioned earlier, plays a big role. And then just kind of also a little off topic, which is funny enough right now I'm in Denver. It's not even in California over the weekend. Went on a long run and I didn't bring enough hydration enough water with me. And I was like, there's a hilarious, you know, I was trying to look for a nearby water fountain. So it even, it's honestly really easy to, if you're not planning, you know, where you're running during your training, during your actual, I guess race day, there's available spots oftentimes, but still, if you're not thinking ahead, I'm like, you know, where, where you're going to be getting water. Having to refill it can get you in. And I was, I was feeling sick after, after that those nine miles I was feeling or sorry, eight miles, I was feeling sick. And so it's, you know, that just definitely think about your, where you're going to be running. If you run out of waters are going to be a nearby gas station. You can run into, to, to pick up a water bottle really quickly. That's maybe, you know, one big component as well. Yeah, trying to think if there's anything else. Kevin Chang: I think you bring up a really good point, which is environment doesn't just mean temperature. They also does mean humidity. So like the more humid it gets, the more you actually sweat, the more the temperature actually affects your body. So humidity actually plays a big role in that. And then altitude if you're at Denver, very dry very arid climates. I know cause I grew up there. So that actually plays a big, big role. You know, in, in Denver, you're at a higher altitude where the sun actually plays a bigger role as well. So that all affects how you run the pace that you can run. You know, we have all, we all know about, you know, the thinner air at altitude. But it also affects your hydration, your nutrition, a lot of those things. Jasmine Sanch: Yeah, it's funny. And it's like, I'm calling myself a self-proclaimed hydration expert. Meanwhile, you know, look at me over the weekend. But yeah, I mean just another thing that came to mind too is, you know, so thinking about. Mentioned earlier, are you incorporating electrolytes into the mix? So if you're not already think about, ask yourself a couple of questions, you know, like how, what is my sweat rate? Maybe you can compare it to one of those generic answers online. And if you see that a title. Then that might mean you need to think about incorporating electrolytes. You know, if you're a heavy, sweaty sweater or a salty sweater, then that means that might mean you should think about incorporating electrolytes. And then I mentioned also that I've spoken to like a lot of running retail owners and one of them I remember on during one discussion that I had. Talked about how oftentimes runners are not coming into their shop till a week to a few days before their actual race to, to ask about hydration. And and so they're, they're, you know, they want to also hammer in on like the importance of hydration. So another thing is like, if you do decide to incorporate electric, Try not to do it, you know, a couple of days or the day of your run. And because this is rare, but in some case you don't want to upset your stomach. So you want to make sure that whatever you're doing, you give yourself, you know, one week, two weeks, honestly, it should really be two weeks of adjustment to let your body adjust to whatever it is that you're incorporating, that you haven't incorporated in the past. Kevin Chang: Great advice, Bertrand Newson: All hydration is not equal. I mean, as much as we've talked a lot about water, they're going to be times when it's more appropriate to have something else other than water and knowing, you know, beer is not always in. Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. Bertrand Newson: we, some of us, some of us, some of us have learned that the hard way I'm speaking on behalf of a friend but where it is more appropriate to replace with electrolytes because can you know, this is the question we actually posed to Brian Frank with Hemlibra. Hypothetically, if you're running a half marathon or marathon in warmer temperatures, you know, you're going to sweat and know you're losing some level of electrolytes, but in this flask right here, it's water, whatever you're better off and replacing fluids with electrolytes. Or am I, if I continue with water, am I diluting my system sweating up more electrolytes? Is that going to make me more prone to cramping and dehydration? When they say water, water, water, water, water. But in certain situations, I mean, so just want to get, get the, the, the team school. Kevin Chang: Yeah. I mean, and I think his school of thought was, you know, again, everybody's different. So it's not likely that you'll be able to do it, a sweat analysis. I mean, you can, you can definitely take your sweat to a laboratory. They do that all the time. There are definitely salty sweaters versus, you know, people that don't sweat as salty that don't need as many electrolytes replenish. And he actually said that there is an interesting study where potentially your sodium, that you're eating in your diet has a major impact on how salty of a sweater you are. So actually, if you want to require it, Electrolytes on race day, you actually may be able to impact your diets leading up to race day. So reducing the sodium, leading up to race day and may actually help reduce the amount of salt as you need on recently. So interesting. Jasmine Sanchs: But that is very interesting. I hadn't heard that. So that is something, you know, I learned something new every day. Yeah, no, I mean, that would be my answer too, is everyone is different. And actually I do also mention that in the ebook, which is like, if you're noticing some very abnormal patterns around your, you know, hydration or sweat, Check out a lab. There are labs actually that I, I can't recall the name and I think I might've linked it in the ebook and I'm not an affiliate or anything by any means, but I saw a lab that specializes in just runners, working with renters to figure out what their sweat rate is and like what's going on with their, with their, you know, what their abnormal patterns, I don't even know where they're based, but I can't remember at the top of my head, but yeah, there are definitely, you know, if you want to get really into the nitty gritty. Checkout, you know, there's definitely professionals out there that can, I can help give you those very very, very accurate answers. Bertrand Newson: Well, this is what we, the message. We want our listeners to hear drink Drink, drink. Expressing if you're out you know, for more than the 45 minutes to an hour in exposed, you know, your direct son, you know, that you have a moderate to high sweat rate, take something with you because what you don't want to do is you do not want to suffer heat, stroke or dehydration. And yeah, and if whatever you can do to avoid that, let that be the lesson figure. And that's one of the reasons that, you know, I give Kevin a lot of credit for the hydration challenge for the month of August, with RaceMob, 16 ounces of water to start the day in the morning, just get in the habit of starting right there, because that may be something for a majority of people. They didn't do. You know? Yeah. And just to get in that habit and then to see how you feel, does it make you more alert? There are a lot of physical benefits just by drinking more water period. So if you can get in the habit of just drinking more water and then there's a lot of cookie cutter formulas based on your weight. Okay. On how many X amount of. But if you get to a, just as consistent baseline, that is a good thing that gets you kind of ahead of the curb. Versus always being in a constant state of dehydration, just in general, let alone in athletes which is a different level, a different B. So drink water first and foremost, get those first couple of glasses in early in the morning, and then challenge yourself, you know, Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. And just to add to that, it's like, you know, this isn't this is really for anyone, but you would be surprised. Much more water. You are naturally going to drink. If you have a larger water puddle, I know it's such a easy, it sounds so easy, so simple, but you know, I, I don't know. Some people don't really have, you know, a really kind of go-to water bottle or they use very small ones. So I have bought this huge water bottle I bought this six months ago and I love it. Bertrand Newso: How many ounces. Yeah. Jasmine Sanchs: I believe that it is 46. Bertrand Newson: Yep. You got me beat. Kevin Chang: tip. I love that too. Jasmine Sanchs: I mean, it's simple, not even for runners is for Kevin Chang: oh man. He coaches, coaches bringing up the gallon, but gallon two gallon bottle. Bertrand Newson: I don't, always drink water, but when I do yeah, this is my, my, my go-to. So. Kevin Chang: Love it. Jasmine has how's the training coming. so, you mentioned that you have an injury but that you're doing some marathon training. How, how has that. Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. So it's going good. Actually, I have been solely upping my mileage week by week and honestly, some, some weeks I'm in the midst of just working and it's, it's tough. But, but I have, I have you know, I have some, my marathon is December, so I, right now I'm really trying to drill in. On the training. I've been dealing with, you know, right knee injury for several years, kind of spent a long time neglecting it. And then really when, when this knee injury started, it was like 2019, the last in-person race that I did. And I was like, just this very sharp pain in my knee. And I almost had a crawl basically against across the finish line. And even to this day, you know, sometimes it's. Or not to this day, but you know, even a year ago it was still, you know, during certain runs longer runs, I would feel the sharp pain. So anyways, beginning of this year, one of my goals was just like, stop neglecting it. You know, I'm, I'm so young. So I, I wanted to take care of this. So I've been doing, going to therapy, working with the chiropractor or doing daily workouts and yeah, I've been taking supplements, all this stuff. So that's a whole nother discussion. Bertrand Newson: Are you seeing our friends at a competitive edge, Jasmine Sanchs: I am. Yeah, right now, since I am Denver, it's been kind of, I've just been doing the workouts here, but I have been. Yeah. And so they've been extremely helpful. You know, sometimes it's, you know, I think one of the reasons why I neglected it for so long, which is, you know, the price, it's not, you know, we're kind of overcoming an injury. It's not cheap, but I kind of had to. Get some perspective and say, Hey, this is my body. If I want to keep on with running, I love running. I just, I got to invest this time right now. So, you know, I don't want to get surgery one day. So anyways yeah, that's been kind of the hurdle, but for the most part, I've been seeing some slow progress. So I'll be doing that, man. Bertrand Newson: Good. Good. And have our, we can, we can help. I know we've talked about, you know, you, both you and Jalen getting some, some training tips and nice and steady, you know, Rome wasn't built in a day, listen to your body. And again other support in regards to chiropractic and PT do that self-care work. I mean, Kevin and I preached that to our athletes that is just as, or even more important in some cases in the consistent work because athletes enjoy the, the, the middle distance runs the long runs, but it's that. Okay. And everyone's pressed for time, you know, do I have to do a warmup exercise? Do I have to do a cool-down? Do I have to foam roll? I mean, you know, I'm feeling okay, right? But your best ability is availability. So if you are not able to complete the workouts, then it makes it much tougher to tow the line, especially for a marathon. So stay on top of that other work that is supporting your running. Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. You know, just kind of something that came to mind. For anyone that is kind of jumping into that first half marathon or first marathon or whatever the case may be, even a 10 K something that's going to require more time out of your day. Just, you know, keep in mind, keep, keep that in mind. You know, for me before I started this training, I, you know, would work a lot longer. Whereas now I'm like, all right, this marathon is going to take a big commitment for me. So if I have. Get off work a little bit earlier than I want to, I have to do it. So I think that's just coming to the understanding that, Hey, this is a time commitment. Just be ready for that. It is a time commitment and it's okay. You know, like this is a, you know, three month process, four month process, depending on how long you need. But that was just something that I didn't really understand until now. Kevin Chang: Incredible. Where can our audience find you? So we know that you have a fantastic Instagram account. We know that vessel athletics has a website and everything. So tell our audience where they can find you online. Jasmine Sanchs: Yeah. So, I mean, I think that I'm most active on Instagram. The jazz friends is what, it's, what it's, that's my personal Instagram account or vessel athletics, the Instagram account. You could definitely, you know, if you are interested in learning about when we release the product you can come to our website to sign up. I'm not really sure. Blasting people with emails every week, or it's probably not even every month. It's just really when there are updates. So there, you know, if anyone is interested in maybe being aware tester, once we get some more samples, giving us feedback on whatever the case may be. Sometimes they send surveys on random things. If you're interested, if you're willing, I'd really, really appreciate that. Just come to our website, sign up. And I email very, very not very frequently at all. So you can definitely get more info there. And the hydration report. I know you both said you'll be linking it. So yeah, definitely, you know, leverage that, feel free to reach out. If you have any questions around that ebook, if there's something that you. Wants to see in the, you broke that you didn't see, let me know. Actually I got feedback saying, Hey, can you do a quick little voiceover recording? Walk me through the process of filling out this spreadsheet. So I did that today. I recorded that today. I'll be posting that. So I'm open to feedback. I love feedback. I love talking to people feel free to connect with me that way. Bertrand Newson: And speaking of talking to people, we're going to have you for a town hall. In the coming weeks as well. So people have the opportunity firsthand to have some great Q&A back and forth with Jasmine in regards to your own personal hydration. More information on product release and potential product testing. I'm getting more familiar with vessel athletics. So fantastic. Kevin Chang: Awesome. Well, Thank you so much for being on the show today, Jasmine. I'm sure this is again, just the beginning of a great partnership friendship. And so it still thankful to have you on the show today. Jasmine Sanchs: Likewise. I'm very thankful love what you both are doing and yeah, I'm honored again. Thanks for the time. Bertrand Newson: Our sincere pleasure. Kevin Chang: Well, I hope you enjoyed this episode of the RaceMob podcast. Check out all of the show notes or find a running buddy online at RaceMob dot com. Please subscribe to us on apple, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to your podcasts and leave us a review until next time. Keep on moving.